Artificial Intelligence: Real Talk

Matthew: All right. Well, hello everyone. Welcome back to our podcast that has yet to have a name that we are putting together as we speak. Building the plane while we're flying it, I think is a good way to put this. And, um, I am joined today, but again, we were together last week. We're back again this week. He's kinda helping me along, getting this process started, and, uh, pushing my buttons when need be, which is much appreciated. Which is much appreciated. So Jethro Jones, thank you, for coming again and helping me stay afloat in this, beginning of this journey that I have here.

Jethro: Yeah, man, no problem. I'm excited to, to help you with this and excited to, to see what you create from it. And I see great potential in you, and so that's why I push your buttons sometimes

Matthew: I, you know, and everybody needs that. Like, and I know a lot of your background, you know, as an educational leader, and so I'm sure you are an expert of knowing when to push buttons and when to pull back. You know, know when to hold them, when to fold them,

Jethro: Yep, that's right

Matthew: in the words of, of Kenny Rogers. The whole thing here is we're going for this AI in education angle. I want to attack things that I see happen on TikTok and LinkedIn, because those are two places I'm really active. And it's also really interesting because I see two opposing things happening on both platforms. My TikTok feed is full of negativity. Don't ever use AI. It's the worst thing ever. It's gonna kill your creativity, and it's gonna steal jobs, the data center, the, the environmental concerns, all that, is what I see on TikTok. I come over to LinkedIn, and it's a much more hopeful view of, of education in particular because I see these people that have these wonderful ideas. They're, they're leaders. They're, you know, consultants from all over the world and stuff. So it's really cool to see both of those perspectives. So you have this perspective of being this educational leader. So, like, in this space right now, where do you stand in terms of AI in education? Like, which side of that fence would you say you're on or closer to?

Jethro: Yeah. So for me, the big thing is if we use, if we use AI to expand and improve ourselves, we create what I call cognitive equity. if we use it to, uh, circumvent learning or to skip things that are actually beneficial for us, then we create cognitive debt. what I don't want is for us to adopt this kind of thing in schools, either as adults or with kids, basically just circumvent all the learning that needs to happen. And there are... The, the thing for me is that I've, I've been interested in this stuff, and I wrote a book back in 2012 called The Paperless Principal, which was all about automation and using, uh, automation tools to make my job better and easier. And what I was automating were the things that were, uh, pointless for me to do, things that I didn't need to be spending all my time on. For example, let me, let me just give you an example of something that I created just this week. I'm working with a driving school that is local here in Spokane where I live, they want some help, like, being a modern approach to driving instruction. And so what they're doing is they're doing all their classes on Zoom, and kids log in from wherever. what I built for them was a, a, a tool that takes attendance automatically when kids log into Zoom and, and logs when they log in and when they log off. And so the teacher should not ever, in my opinion, need to go through and say, "Johnny, are you present?" Check. "So and so, are you present?" Check. No. with using Zoom, you can tell when people log on and when they exit. Automatically, you can get their attendance and take care of it. That's the kind of menial thing that we don't need to waste time on. here's a really important thing. If taking attendance gives you an opportunity to have a short, brief, positive interaction with each student, that's a very different thing. And in that situation, yes. Yes, you should have that positive, brief interaction. instead of it being, "Let me take attendance for the sake of making sure that I know that you were here so that I can remember later when the Department of Licensing audits what we're doing in this driving school," that's the wrong reason to take attendance. And that purpose, the compliance piece, should be automated, should be trusted, and we should be able to also override that and say, "Oh, you know what? These siblings were on the call together, so we're gonna mark John as present with his sister, Michelle." That is totally appropriate, and, and that's what we should be going for. We should definitely automate the things that are not meaningful and valuable, and we should definitely not automate the things that are meaningful and valuable

Matthew: I, I love all of that. That is, that is a core message that I give to our teachers and our admins when I do professional developments in, you know, my region here in Central Pennsylvania. But the, the big one I come up with, and I just did, um, I just talked to our assistant executive director about this I asked her, "How do you determine the valuable work?" 'Cause you said, you know, I wanted to do the, the menial work, the menial tasks, right? And so from a leadership perspective, I'm sure you have a whole bunch of lists of tasks, and she gave... She told me her whole list of tasks that she had running the whole, you know, IU8 as the assistant director. Um, so how do you assign value to the different tasks?

Jethro: Yeah, so there are definitely several different ways to look at this. So let's start with the one that is personal to each person, which is what are the things that you are procrastinating on doing? What are the things that you are avoiding doing? Let's automate those things. if, if they're just, if they're not going to get done because you're procrastinating, then find a way to automate it in some way so that it works. Let's be real personal and talk about the podcast here, for example.

Matthew: Yeah.

Jethro: so one of the things that I did many years ago is I created an automation to make it so that when people wanted to be on my podcast, that they would, would click a calendar link, and they would schedule a time, it would send them a Google Doc as a preparation document. It would send them an email and a calendar invite, and it would send them the Zoom link and all that stuff, and now it's the Descript link, 'cause that's what I use to record. It would do all that stuff automatically so that I wasn't the bottleneck in making that stuff happen. you, I said, "You're gonna record every week at this specific time, so you make sure that you are ready to record at this specific time." And that was me eliminating that bottleneck for you automating it, by saying, "Your recording time is every week at this time." Now, I did that, I pushed that on you because I knew that that was a bottleneck for everybody who does a podcast.

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: we don't want it to be a bottleneck. you've got that rhythm down, you're welcome to change it, of course, and do things differently, but the key is the things that prevent you from succeeding and see if there's a way to automate that. if you're, you're delaying because you're trying to do something perfect, the AI do it will, will help you get past that, and it's sometimes a lot easier to edit something that wasn't perfect it is to start the task from the beginning. So number one,

Matthew: Right

Jethro: at the things that are naturally delaying you. Any questions about that before I go on?

Matthew: N- no, I'm just, I'm, I'm processing all of this and I, I was actually hoping that you would bring up

Jethro: Yeah.

Matthew: conversation that we just had because it is extremely relevant to this one here. Um, you know, and that... I'll, I'll build on this 'cause there, there's a, there's a follow-up that I would love to ask you, but I would love for you to continue, so yeah

Jethro: Yeah. so write that follow-up down 'cause,

Matthew: Yeah.

Jethro: I might not answer it. So the second thing is the things that you are good at doing, you've developed systems and processes for doing them quickly and that you have taken care of. So some of those things can be, um, can be things that are technical in nature. of them can be things that are not technical in nature. But for example, whenever somebody would ask me for a letter of recommendation, I would take a template that I had already saved of letters of recommendation, and I would replace the person's name and then edit a few things within that, because I liked how that thing looked. Now, that's all well and good. In the AI era, we create skills which are basically just standard operating procedures that we give to the AI and say, "Do things this way," and, and let it go on about its business. So if you've already figured out a way to make things quicker or easier, can go ahead and automate those things as well. One of

Matthew: I like that

Jethro: that I used to believe that you should not automate gratitude, then I realized that actually automating gratitude may not be a bad thing, because you should, you should express that as much as possible. And so I'm, I'm going back and forth on that, because I don't want to automate gratitude and make it something that is meaningless because it's not actually from me. But at the same time, I don't... If I don't automate it, then perhaps it just doesn't get done. So

Matthew: Or, or you don't, or you don't do it enough.

Jethro: Yes, that's

Matthew: Or, or you don't do it enough, yeah.

Jethro: Yeah. So, so would I rather have everybody get a generic gratitude from me and they at least know that I'm grateful, or would I rather have, some people get a heartfelt gratitude? where I'm at right now is that a generic gratitude to everybody is probably better because that's what I want to do, I still have the ability to give a heartfelt gratitude to somebody later. So for example, I just graduated with my doctorate, and people gave me a thank you, and gave me gifts and things like that, for which I was very grateful. And I wrote a handwritten note to everybody who gave me something because I wanted to make sure that I said thank you. And I sent it through the mail intentionally so that they could get something in the mail, and I did not want to just, like, hand it to them or something like that. So sending it through the mail is an automated thing. I'm not deliver-- hand-delivering it to them. But that's part of the point is I want it to be more special than just, "Oh, I happened to see you, so here's the, the gratitude." So those

Matthew: Absolutely

Jethro: are three things that I'm thinking about with automation. Uh, questions, comments, thoughts, concerns, compliments?

Matthew: Well, I love all, a- and I like, it, it's almost, it seems to me that you've been asked this question before.

Jethro: Yeah

Matthew: You were like, "Boom, boom, boom. I got bullets, I got, yeah, I'm ready to go." So no, and I, and I think, um, you know, that is along the same lines of what my assistant director said, too, is like, uh, her example that she shared, one of her tasks to do was she wanted to compile a list of every service that our IU8 offers. Now, this is hundreds of services across special education, early childhood education. Um, you know, we have consultants. I'm one of them. I do AI and emerging technology. Uh, you know, uh, all this stuff. We have all this stuff that, that we offer. But they wanted a place for all this to go together, and she came to me from the beginning saying, "I have, like, a month to do this, and there is no way that I'm gonna be able to put this together and make it look nice and pretty on my own." So can, she started with the curiosity that we talked about last time.

Jethro: Yep

Matthew: AI do this thing? And I said, "100%. Uh, let's, let's go down a couple different pathways here." And in, like, two weeks she took a... 'Cause all of us, we had to fill out an Excel spreadsheet that was, uh, the, our job, you know, what the service was, all that stuff. We, we filled, and it was kind of all over the place, and AI took that spreadsheet and organized it all by department, then organized it all alphabetically, then made it look like a, a publication.

Jethro: Yep. Mm-hmm

Matthew: you know, put it all together with all the formatting of a publication, and she printed that out, put, you know, got it, you know, binded. And so we, we have X numbers of copies that are physical, but now it's, like, a beautiful put-together thing. And she said, "There is no way ever that I, on my own, would have been able to get that done at all." And so an example right there, right? It's like I have all the information, but putting it together and making it look presentable, look useful and valuable, and organizing it, um, invaluable. You know? So that, that kind of task.

Jethro: Yeah.

Matthew: and, and, and that's, yeah. Go ahead.

Jethro: so what I'll add there is that that's the kind of task where it ex- expands what you're able to do because it is... So let me share a quick story. I worked at the district office, uh, for, for a couple years, and one of the things that we needed to do was create a, um, a, uh... what's the word? An infographic about

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: our dual immersion courses, uh, schools that we had in the district. so this is where kids were learning a second language and, uh, while they were in school, and we had all this information, and we put this infographic together, it took me and another, uh, person at the district level, it took us, like, six hours working together to get this thing done, and we stayed until, like, 8:00 that night, and it took a really long time. Now, was it beautiful and wonderful in the end? Yes, it sure was. however, today, we could make that much better with the help of AI because it can take all that information that we had and put it into a visually appealing thing that is valuable and worthwhile. and what the effort we put into that was, was gargantuan as, as when you consider what we were actually working on and what we needed to be working on. And it was just, be honest, it was r- a really big waste of time, and need to happen that way. But we wanted it to look really pretty and, and make an impact, which it did. Then it went to a board meeting. They said, "Okay, great," and then they just moved on. It was totally stupid. So, like,

Matthew: And you were like, "Yay."

Jethro: gee, thanks. And, and I was really proud of that work, but the thing is, I didn't, I didn't have a good context around whether or not it would be valuable to deliver it in that way. And, and I thought it would be more well-received or more valued than it actually was, and it just wasn't. So, you know, those are the kinds of things where when you can take something that be much better and make it something that is more than just a list of pages. You know, I was, I was working with, uh, another company to onboard schools into their, their program. And so I created, using AI, a nicely designed QR code with the company logo there in the middle so that it was unique to them. And the QR code also had the school name across the top, so they knew they were going to the right QR code, and they weren't going to the wrong place. if you're at and such middle school, you know this is your, your thing. in that situation, could have just delivered them a list of the school names with the links, that would have been fine. However, I thought it'd be a lot better to- a nice branded QR code that looks good, that's not going to be stuck behind some paywall and not work at some point. Uh,

Matthew: Right

Jethro: going to work forever. And that kind of a thing, it worked. It turned out really beautiful. It was valuable to schools and to the company that I was doing it for. like, that became really valuable, uh, for to share with them and, and if I didn't have AI to help with that, to be honest, I probably just would have not done it

Matthew: Right. Right. Exactly. And so my, my segue here, digging back now into the educator side is we as adults, I feel like are really good at coming up with value systems for when I should and shouldn't use AI, um, in terms of tasks and, you know, automation and things like that. So we're pretty good at coming up with this list. How do we teach kids to do that? You know, like how, how, how can you teach and how could you w- like work this in to show them something that's valuable versus not valuable? Because what I see on the negative side on TikTok is that right now students are leaning towards using it for almost all of their work because they are viewing almost all of their work as not valuable. And so it's like

Jethro: It's

Matthew: right? It's...

Jethro: That, that's the

Matthew: That's a

Jethro: Their work is not valuable, and they all know it. That's, that's what the real problem is, and that's the problem that we face in education that we have to have a reckoning for, is that h- here's the thing. In 2020 when the pandemic happened, we told kids all across the country and the world, "Hey, guess what? All those things we told you are important, just made it up. to

Matthew: Yeah.

Jethro: is not important. Taking these tests is not important." And it's gonna take us generations overcome that. we have AI, and the kids can all use it, and they're like, "Why wouldn't I use this when the whole point of school right now is to check off assignments?" That's it. That is what we have created. Now, some people are doing things differently, and they have, like, project-based learning. And the point is to create something that is of value. But the problem is right now is that most of our schools are focused on compliance, and if you do this thing, then you'll get a good grade. And that drives everything. And so

Matthew: Right

Jethro: we pretend like learning actually matters in schools, but it doesn't. What matters in schools is compliance and checking things off of a list. That's what we are actively teaching kids to do. So what's the best tool in the world for doing that across all kinds of domains? Artificial intelligence. These LLMs can totally take anything we give it and, and just do it. And because that's the point, that's what kids are turning to. to be honest, I do not blame them. If I had AI when I was a kid, I would have totally done it too. that's why cheating happens, that's why plagiarism happens. It's because we're not focused on actual learning. And that's where we as educators need to change and be focused on learning and not just giving assignments

Matthew: Oh. So what in your mind is, would be an example? Like, what would be a good best case scenario for showcasing learning, allowing the learning that you're talking about to happen? Like, 'cause I use a phrase now that we have, we as teachers have a really hard job. We have to convince students that learning is still important, and you just said learning doesn't matter. So

Jethro: No, no, no, that is

Matthew: yeah.

Jethro: I said.

Matthew: I forget what else you said after that. We have, well, we can pull it back.

Jethro: Yeah, let me be clear.

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: Learning has never been the focus of school.

Matthew: Ah,

Jethro: the

Matthew: okay. Gotcha

Jethro: were the focus of school, would approach s- learning and school differently. We

Matthew: Understood

Jethro: that learning is the focus, but it's not. But it should be, and that's what I contend it is. So,

Matthew: Gotcha

Jethro: so we, we never, we never have to try to make learning valuable. That's the thing. We don't ever have to try to convince kids that learning is valuable because they know it inherently. They know that learning is valuable. But we have tried to make kids think that doing worksheets, doing assignments, taking tests equals learning, but it doesn't. the first thing that you do to show that learning is valuable is you stop making it so that you have a single audience for assignments. If you just did this, you would get, like, 75% of the way there. Instead of it being your teacher's the one who sees this because you turn into her, make it so that it is the audience is more than the teacher. So either you're sharing with the whole class, you're sharing it with a partner, you're publishing it online, or hanging it up in the walls. that happens, then learning become, becomes more of the point, and presentation becomes more of the point. So when it's just the teacher, cares because it's just the teacher reading it, and she's going to give it whatever grade she gives it, which, by the way, grades are all made up, so that's another little thing we can, we can go off

Matthew: So it's like, whose line is it anyway,

Jethro: Yeah,

Matthew: There are no rules and the points don't matter

Jethro: So exactly, that's what it's like. So if just the teacher sees it, the kids have no incentive to care about it. If somebody else sees it, they automatically get a little bit of an incentive. The more people that see it, the more likely they are to say, "Oh yeah, this does actually matter, and I, I do care about this." So, so that's the number one thing. Have more of an audience than just the teacher. The other thing is that you can't just give an assignment and say, "Complete this worksheet, do these problems, this essay," whatever. Again, there has to be a purpose behind it. So if we take, for example, uh, in, uh, in English class... I was an English teacher, and I, kids write essays all the time. The, the most effective year that I had of writing with my students was when Steve Jobs... Now we're going back in time. Steve Jobs wrote this essay that was about, um, about should DRM exist on music, and he was making the point that DRM should not exist on music, and if music were so easy to purchase, people would just buy it instead of downloading it, uh, for free off the internet. And he was right, and now people just subscribe to, to music things to get their music.

Matthew: Correct

Jethro: that was all right. But the, the point there was I said, "Students, we are learning how to write argumentative essays. Here's an example of an argumentative essay that Steve Jobs wrote to convince people that we should take DRM off of music." one, this was very intriguing to kids who were in middle school 'cause they love music.

Matthew: Oh yeah. Yep

Jethro: this was something that was currently happening in the world, they saw from that example the power of writing a persuasive or argumentative essay, and they saw that it was worthwhile to learn how to communicate effectively to get people to believe what you're saying. So number one, more than one audience. Number two, make it something that is real, relatable, and worthwhile. And then the third thing is that beyond just making it real and relatable, have it actually mean something to them in their life. So instead of saying, "You have to read this book that we're telling you to read to learn these things," it really doesn't matter what book you're reading. Go read any book and find these themes that are universal across everything. If you're in a science class, do this real experiment and make it a real experiment. Part of the problem with science class is that we already know everything that we're teaching the kids,

Matthew: Mm-hmm.

Jethro: how do we help them learn it by doing their own experimentation and following that process?

Matthew: I love how you say that because I was a science teacher for the last, you know, eight years, and I fell in love with a science program, uh, Mystery Science, you know, shout out to them, because it was all hands-on. Like, like the whole thing was hands-on. So they'd, they'd watch an exploratory video that would pose questions and make it a mystery, and then you'd do a hands-on activity that would help you understand how to arrive at the answer to that mystery. And I started every single year, I made the same speech with Mystery Science. I said, "You all could go right now and Google every answer to every question of all of these lessons, and you can just find all the answers right now." I said, "But you won't take the lesson with you. You won't, you won't take it with you. You won't internalize it. It won't be in your DNA of knowledge. It won't be there." And you getting to actually experience the thing, actually do the thing, and relate it to the things in our area, which I love their activities where we got to go outside, you know? It was like, "Let's go outside and see how this actually works in the real world." Um, that, like, that was the big connector piece. And of course, wouldn't you know it, every single kid, "I love science. Science is my favorite subject." And why? Because science is all about actually doing the thing. You're not just sitting in your desk listening the whole class. You are up and moving around. You get to go outside sometimes. You get to go to the lab sometimes. And so I, I, I love that. I think that hits, that hits home.

Jethro: Yeah. So if, if you do that with every subject, then world becomes your oyster and you're like, "Yeah, this is great. I can... learning." Because kids do love learning. That's the thing. Kids are curious, and they love learning, and we have created a system where everything is siloed, nothing is

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: and it is totally opposite the world in which they live. And they see

Matthew: True

Jethro: is fake, and it is ridiculous, and they see that it doesn't actually work that way in the real world, and it makes them frustrated. And even kindergartners get it. Like, this

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: not rocket science. They understand it intuitively from the very beginning. So y- your point about you can Google all these answers, you can have AI do all of this for you. So if that's the issue, then yeah, let's... Why don't we bring AI in and say, "Let's, let's create some stuff, and let's make it meaningful"? And then you go start creating stuff, you see what happens. And then the point isn't, did you write this essay? The point is, did you create something of value and meaningful? And, and you're going to learn through that process, and you're gonna learn things that aren't connected to the exact subject matter. we have this problem in schools where we think that we have to learn things in isolation, we

Matthew: Right.

Jethro: In fact,

Matthew: Right

Jethro: probably one of the worst ways to learn.

Matthew: Right.

Jethro: If you're in the middle of writing something, and you're like, "Oh, I wish I understood better how this scientific principle works," you're not gonna be like, "Oh, I'll figure that out in five years when I take that science class." No, you're gonna go do that right now, so you can understand it and have it make sense in what you're trying to do. And at that point, then learning becomes exponential

Matthew: Right

Jethro: you're not just trying to accomplish an assignment. You're trying to learn the thing for the, for the actual purpose for which you need it, which then you're also going to remember it so much better

Matthew: Correct. I still remember, I, I made a TikTok a while ago, but I still remember all the projects that I've, that I've ever done. Every project that I've ever done, those are the things that stick out in my mind. And no, and, and, and any of the writing that I did, even in college, like it's not something I would save and be like, "Oh, let's, let's turn this into a Substack," you know? It's, it was relevant to that time and, and that time is gone. And, you know, so, so that's where all of those assign- But, but every project I'll never forget, you know? Shout out to my mom. The Yellow Submarine project I did in 10th grade history class. I built a little, a literal yellow submarine out of poster board, filled it with bags so that it would be 3D, and did a biography, all the windows of the sub on one side were each mem- band member and little mini biographies, and on the other side was their discography of, of a couple of the ones I picked and why I thought they were important. And at the time, this is, this is a nice throwback. At the time, this was the revolutionary technology. I bought a mini recorder from like, uh, Michael's, and you could record like a 10-second clip and then it would play back every time you hit the button, and that was like the maximum at the time. So I found a way to put that in to the submarine in one of the windows or the whatever they call that thing that, that pops up from the top. Yeah, that one. Okay. Yeah, the periscope.

Jethro: Yeah

Matthew: And I put it on there so that when you touched it, it played a 10-second clip of, "We all live in the Yellow Submarine." It was like the coolest project ever. My history teacher said, "This is one of the most unique projects that anyone has ever given me. Um, do you mind if I keep it 'cause I wanna share it with other classes that come through here?" And I said, "Cool." I have never felt so accomplished in my life as when that teacher was like, "Can I keep this and show it to everybody else?"

Jethro: And,

Matthew: know?

Jethro: and here's the thing that you're not saying. that was for a particular class for a particular project, but all the other things that you learned a- as the process of doing that is, is what made that valuable to you. It wasn't a single subject

Matthew: Nope

Jethro: that... You, you... will note you did not say what the actual purpose of that project was,

Matthew: Nope.

Jethro: you remembered it, right?

Matthew: Exactly. Exactly

Jethro: So, so that could have been for any class. And, and here's the key. When you move learning to this kind of a, a situation... Now, I, I have a good friend who is a big fan of explicit direct instruction,

Matthew: Yes

Jethro: and that's all well and good for things for which there is a clear answer and that you need that specific answer for, and that's fine. However, we have turned our schools into that is the whole thing,

Matthew: That's it

Jethro: and really we need to just narrow that piece down. And when somebody needs to learn something, for example, how do I make it so that when I push the periscope it's gonna play the song? The whatever mechanics or physics are behind that, you needed to learn how to make that happen for that s- particular thing, and you could replicate that 20 years later because you learned the right thing at the right time for what you needed it for. So I call that just-in-time learning, that you learn things just in time for when you need them, which means that these scopes and sequences that we have for kids learn this in eighth grade and this in 10th grade and this in fifth grade, those can really be thrown out the window because what we really need to understand is when do you need to learn this information for whatever it is that you're working on that has meaning in your life, that's when we should teach it to you. we don't need to

Matthew: I like that

Jethro: until to learn algebra. We don't need to wait until calculus to learn calculus. We don't need to wait until chemistry to learn chemistry. We need to learn those things when we need them. So just-in-time learning makes it so that when you need to know something, you have the opportunity to learn it. But our school systems are not designed that way because we have grade level standards that we think kids need to progress through, and the reality is kids are ready for things way earlier than the, the scope and sequence says they are. They're ready for it when they need it, and that's what we need to

Matthew: Ag-

Jethro: on

Matthew: agreed. Agreed. Well, something I'd like to start as a tradition here. We'll, we'll see. I'll probably name it something after this. We'll, we'll come up with a catchy name. But, um, at all of my professional developments that I do, I pride myself on the fact that I give the audience, the te- whoever it is, teachers, you know, special ed, OTPT, whoever is the audience, I give them time to work with the tools or work with whatever I just talked, whatever I just taught you. We're gonna do an example that's relevant to you and your case. Um, and I like to give them something to take away that they can walk in, you know, next day, next week, whatever, something they can use. So Monday morning takeaway, Monday morning, we'll, we'll call it something. Anyway, we'll come up with it. But so what would be that thing that, that you hope people can take with them and ease into AI or get into it? Or, or, you know, you gave a bunch of good, you know, lists of, of things that we can do, but if you had to narrow down to like a specific task, easy to do thing that, that educators could walk away with

Jethro: Yeah, so I'll focus on teachers since that's what we were talking about here at the

Matthew: Yeah.

Jethro: And the thing

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: teachers would be at one of your assignments or units or something coming up and say, can I take the barriers off of this?" And let it be either an additional audience person that they are gonna show this to, that it is real world and applicable to them, that it is something where they can something new right when they need it. Uh, look at one of your assignments and just... and analyze how you could adjust it and do it a little bit differently. if you share that with me, @JethroJones on all the social medias, I would love to see it because it is just the start. And once you start doing that and you see how your students react, it really changes things. And you're like, "Oh, I should do this more often," because guess what? Everybody has more fun with that. So for, for administrators or people who are not teaching students at the time, I would say look at one thing that you've been delaying doing that you don't wanna do and ask yourself, "How can AI help me do this thing that I, that I've been pushing off?" And whether that's avoiding it because you're, you just don't wanna get it done or because it's perfectionist or whatever the case may be,

Matthew: Yeah

Jethro: AI help me so that this thing actually moves forward and isn't this block in front of me for the foreseeable future? And again, if you reach out to me and say @JethroJones on any of the social networks and show me what you're doing, I would love to see it because this is super fascinating to me to see how to help people figure that stuff out

Matthew: Yeah, and get started.

Jethro: Yeah

Matthew: and it's a great place to start and, and, uh, w- dip your toes in, as they say,

Jethro: exactly.

Matthew: know, and get you in there. So, uh, Jethro, thank you here and, and pushing me when needed.

Jethro: Yeah

Matthew: I appreciate you. Um, and we will see you next time on this podcast that has yet to be named. Uh, he who shall not be named.

Jethro: There you go

Matthew: you know, we'll, we'll figure that out when we get there. So thanks again, Jethro

Jethro: Thank you